How to Support Military Students Beyond Admissions

0:00:12.6 Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Office Hours with EAB. Today’s conversation focuses on a student population that deserves far more intentional support in higher education: military veterans and active duty service members. Our experts share tips to help institutions better understand how to serve these learners beyond the point of admission. So give these folks a listen and enjoy.

0:00:40.7 Beth Donaldson: Welcome everyone, and thanks for joining us for today’s episode of Office Hours with EAB. I’m Beth Donaldson, and I have the pleasure of working with our adult learner recruitment team at EAB. So today, I would love for us to discuss a topic that I really feel deserves far more attention in higher education than we’re currently paying it. And that is how colleges and universities can better support military veterans and active duty service members who want to pursue a college degree but may not know how to do that. So to help us explore that topic today, I am really thrilled to be joined by Sydney Mathes from Service to School, a nonprofit that currently is providing free undergraduate and graduate college search support to the military community. What I love is that Sydney and her team help institutions to understand really the unique perspectives, student needs, and help universities really provide really valuable insight on what effective partnership looks like and where schools still have room to grow in supporting the military community.

0:01:53.6 Beth Donaldson: Sydney is constantly pushing institutions and how they can be more effective in meeting the needs of our adult learners today. So, Sydney, thank you for being here with us. As you can probably tell, I am so excited that you decided to sit down and really have this conversation with me today.

0:02:14.2 Sydney Mathes: Yes, absolutely. Beth, I am truly honored and thrilled to be here with you having this conversation about work that is incredibly near and dear to my heart, but, like you mentioned in the intro, that just truly does not have the kind of, I would say, space to talk about the needs, the aspirations, and how we can better serve our service members. So, thrilled to be here!

0:02:39.7 Beth Donaldson: Okay, great. So, I know that some of our listeners may be new to Service to School, so tell us a little bit about how you would describe your organization’s mission and really the core services that you’ve been able to provide to both veterans and active duty service members.

0:02:57.3 Sydney Mathes: Yes, absolutely. I’m sure the majority of your listeners have not heard of Service to School, so I’m very excited to be here to change that. So, at the root of what we do, we are a national nonprofit that provides free academic and admissions support for veterans and transitioning service members. So, individuals that either have transitioned off of active duty and are now thinking about college, or those who are still in active duty and are thinking, “Okay, what’s next for me after the military?” So, Service to School is truly here to meet them throughout their entire journey from the idea of going to college all the way through the application process. And some of our core services, as you mentioned in the intro, individualized admissions advising. My team here, for the most part, we’re all former admissions officers, which is just incredible to be able to give inside-the-admissions-office guidance, someone who’s read applications, someone who has kind of lived and breathed our work, and now to be able to provide that as a service to our service members. We also have a mentor program, so we pair all of our applicants with a near-peer mentor.

0:04:06.9 Sydney Mathes: So, veterans helping veterans. Really, someone who understands their military experience and has walked the path that they have ahead of them. So, our ambassador program, we have over 500 ambassadors that are supporting the work that we do. We also have partnerships with undergraduate and graduate institutions, 32 undergraduate partners right now and growing. But we work closely with our VetLink partners to better understand our student population and also to understand maybe where some barriers lie in their admissions processes. We do provide graduate admissions, although undergraduate is definitely our bread and butter, but med school, law school, business school, as well as PhD and master’s programs. And then, I know a program that you’re excited about, our wraparound support, our “Two and Through” program. This initiative is to support students after admission. So, it helps them integrate into campuses, it helps campuses better understand the needs of their student population, but also for our students to be, I would say, more aware of both on-campus and off-campus support that is available to them. So, a lot going on here!

0:05:19.4 Beth Donaldson: Really! And from the minute I met you, I felt like we were kindred spirits. And I think it’s because of that admissions counselor background that we both have and share. So, I’d love to hear a little bit more about your role at Service to School and how long you’ve been there and really supporting institutions to really be able to expand their services to the military community.

0:05:43.9 Sydney Mathes: Absolutely. So my role here as CEO is really to expand the scope of higher education for veterans. I mean, that’s really how I wake up in the morning. I hit the ground and think, you know, how can we make this process, this experience, and this journey better for our service members? My journey to Service to School is one that I never thought would take place for myself because I’m not a veteran myself, but I am a very proud military spouse. So from my time as a college counselor, college admissions officer, I had the opportunity to work closely with our veteran applicants and my husband would send me some of his soldiers who had questions about going to college. And he’s like, “Go talk to my wife. That’s what she does.” I was like, “Why is there not an organization that does this work?” And that’s how a Google search led me to Service to School. I started as one of our program managers and now find myself here as the CEO. Just, I just feel honored. It’s an absolute joy to be able to lead this organization and just to continue to advocate for a student population that is traditionally left out of higher education.

0:06:49.0 Beth Donaldson: Well, it’s obvious that they are lucky to have you leading the charge. So can you talk a little bit more about what do veterans need that might be different from the traditional undergraduate or graduate prospective students that they normally are seeing come across their desk? And really talk about what you wish that more admissions counselors clearly understand more about serving this population?

0:07:18.3 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, absolutely. So veterans need access to trustworthy information. There is still a ton of misinformation out there for veterans that I believe leads them towards institutions that have historically been predatory towards veterans. And that they see the GI Bill, they see full pay via the GI Bill, and they don’t necessarily have the admissions or on-campus support structures in place to ensure that this individual is making the appropriate decision for their education. So, clear academic pathways. That could be, “Okay, I have transcripts from the military. I took classes while I was on active duty. What does that look like at your institution?” It means our students need someone who kind of, I don’t want to say, more handholding because that’s not necessarily the case with our student population, but it does require individualized attention, right? So, when I talk with a service member today who served in the Army, the service member who served in the Army that I talk to tomorrow has a very different experience in the military. So I have to meet each student where they are and be able to say, “Okay, this is what you’ve done in service. This is what you want to do after service. Let’s find a college or an academic program that kind of aligns with that pathway.”

0:08:33.2 Sydney Mathes: Also, going back to that access to reputable information, having information clearly outlined on a college’s website is like the starting point. If they go to your website and there’s not information about, “Are you a Yellow Ribbon institution? What does the GI Bill look like? Am I required to live on campus?” That’s information that helps this individual make an informed decision, right? So I would say as much clear information as possible really serves this population well. Also, culturally competent support, right? I think it’s one thing to have an admissions officer who works with their veteran population, but if they don’t know the difference between an officer and someone who’s enlisted, then how can you actually provide appropriate guidance and advice to this student? Someone who truly does understand that military-to-campus transition is really key to understanding what the veteran population needs. And then, the last part of your question: What do I wish most admissions offices knew? Most importantly, I wish every admissions office recognized that veterans aren’t looking for special treatment.

0:09:52.9 Sydney Mathes: I think often with this adult learner population, this non-traditional population, it’s like, “Oh, well, that’s kind of outside of our wheelhouse, and we don’t really know how to recruit them,” when in reality, it’s just thinking about a student population and looking for an opportunity to create a pathway based on feedback from what you’re hearing from your students. So I encourage students to talk to any current student veterans on their campuses. Ask them, “Hey, what was it like when you were applying to our institution?” That’s a lot of what we do here with our partner institutions as well. But when you invest in this student population and truly understand their needs, the payoff is enormous, aside from some of them coming with GI Bill dollars. But not only do veterans succeed, but there’s historical data that shows veterans can truly elevate the entire campus community.

0:10:46.0 Beth Donaldson: That’s so important. And Sydney, I love the fact that you say it about trustworthy information because we know that adult learners are going to the website and looking exactly for what you said, admissions requirements, the transfer credits, the scholarships, so that they can be able to figure out that return on education and investment to decide which school is the right one for them. And if they can’t get that information on the website within 60 to 90 seconds, then they will definitely rule you out of consideration.

0:11:20.8 Sydney Mathes: Absolutely. When you think about it, most traditional students have a school counselor. They have someone in a building that can answer those basic questions, right? But for a lot of our students, they are navigating this process without a school counselor. The majority of our students are first-generation. So when that information is lacking, it truly does do a disservice to the student population.

0:11:45.6 Beth Donaldson: I so agree. So when we’ve chatted before, you’ve shared with me really that enrolling veterans can’t be viewed primarily as a way for the institution to tap into the GI Bill and as a stream of revenue. They really have to be truly committed to this work. And so I want you to talk a little bit about what an authentic institutional commitment to military students looks like.

0:12:13.3 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, absolutely. You know, I truly believe when an institution sees veterans primarily as a source of GI Bill revenue, the experience almost always breaks down, both for the institution and for the student. Only 50% of student veterans complete college once they start it. And that is a huge loss of taxpayer dollars when we’re talking about GI Bill benefits that have essentially gone wasted on unfinished degrees. So, genuine institutional support, kind of going back to that clear transfer credit pathway, especially when COVID was happening and a lot of classes transitioned to online, that was kind of unique to a lot of institutions. But for our student population, they’ve been taking online classes for years. And historically, colleges haven’t seen those as transferable online credits. So, having flexibility in transfer credit ability from one institution to another, we’re working with some institutions to do reverse transfer of credits. So being open to transfer credit pathways is absolutely a need of this population. Transparent admissions processes. Beth, I can’t tell you the number of times I talk with a student and they say, “I don’t know if I apply as a first-year student or a transfer student.”

0:13:28.3 Sydney Mathes: And the website’s not very clear, right? And our general rule of thumb is, “Okay, well, if you have 12 or 15 credits, then you apply as a transfer student.” Well, some schools have veterans, regardless of enrollment, based on their joint service transcript, they apply as a transfer student. At other schools, those credits have to be taken in person at a brick-and-mortar institution, and you have to have two consecutive semesters of academic work; they apply as a first-year student, right? So it’s just, how do we truly expect this student to navigate that when the admissions processes are truly muddy? And then also, someone on-campus with ownership of the veteran experience. I can give you two incredible examples here. One of our partners has found the sweet spot of a veterans center on campus. That is where admissions has an influence. That is where their VA benefits are processed. That’s also where career services is dedicated specifically for the student veteran population. That office is led by a veteran. Now, the number of individuals on a campus who are veterans is incredibly small. I presented at a conference, and of the 60 individuals in the room, there were only two veterans.

0:14:43.8 Sydney Mathes: None of us on the panel were veterans. So I love any opportunity to be an ally and to amplify the need for veterans working in higher education to better support the student population. But the individual who runs that student veteran center, I mean, he’s connecting with his student veterans, with other student veterans on campus and industry mentors, truly has found a way to be the owner of that veteran experience. He schedules a study abroad every year for his veterans that has some type of military component with it. Either they’re visiting historical military sites or they’re going to national monuments. But that really does amplify the student success and what the student can do once they arrive. Another way that ownership of the veteran experience looks like: We had an unfortunate situation at Brown over the weekend, and one of our partners there at Brown, he is so quick and nimble to be able to get in touch with all of his student veterans on campus, make sure they’re all safe, make sure they’re supported, and also provide mental health resources to the student population that have historically not been encouraged to reach out for help.

0:16:01.6 Sydney Mathes: So when you have individuals on campus who are leading these initiatives, it takes that, you know, seeing them as revenue and, more, seeing them as a person and as a student to an entirely different level.

0:16:15.4 Beth Donaldson: That is so important. And we in higher education need to do better because we know that representation matters. And so to your point about the veterans office and services, having a veteran lead that initiative, having more veterans on the team that can clearly understand the process and what is important, really shows that commitment to wanting to grow and support this population better. So I love that.

0:16:42.3 Sydney Mathes: [0:16:42.5] inaudible.

0:16:43.6 Beth Donaldson: Can you tell me a little bit about how Service to School currently partners with institutions to really understand how they can get the most out of their partnership with you and how those benefits are extending beyond the admissions phase and once students are actually enrolled in an academic program of choice?

0:17:05.8 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, absolutely. So, as I mentioned, we have 32 undergraduate partners, whom we work very closely with. We meet quarterly with our partners, and then we also meet over the summer in person, almost as like a one-day “Supporting Student Veterans” convening, if you will. So we partner with universities in a couple of different ways, Beth, and each one essentially is built around a very simple belief that admissions is the starting line, not the finish line for student veterans. Right? Like, the goal is to help them get to and through higher education and transition into a new, meaningful career. So, through our VetLink program, which is where our 32 partners are housed, we provide context around the military experience that leads to, I would say, some of the most incredible college admissions applications that our partners have the opportunity to read when so few Americans serve in the military and even a smaller percentage of that population is applying to college. Think of the essays that you have the opportunity to read and the experiences that are very unique and different from the traditional high school students’ application. So we help our admissions partners understand the context of the environment that the student veteran is coming from.

0:18:18.3 Sydney Mathes: Hopefully then, you know, that individual turns into an applicant, which turns into an individual in their recruitment funnel. Through also that process, we have info sessions for each of our partner schools. We host a virtual college fair. I am also able to introduce a prospective student to the admissions representative that works with our student veterans on that college campus. So it’s that warm handoff that our students truly find meaningful value. And I’ve heard from students often that, “I don’t see a point of contact on the website.” “Okay, well, let me help you suss through all the information.” But when that point of contact is clear, it really does make that personal relationship that leads to a matriculation. Also, through that partnership, you know, we work with our partners to understand what gaps and what barriers might exist, both pre-enrollment but also post-enrollment. So, for this “Two and Through” program that we just wrapped up our one-year pilot, we were able to identify some reasons students weren’t enrolling and deciding to then matriculate. Right? So, the big thing we’re hearing right now is as more institutions increase their investment in students who meet a certain income for demonstrated financial need, veterans often fall under that income threshold.

0:19:39.9 Sydney Mathes: So as institutions are looking for ways to invest in this population, if you are saying you’ll meet full demonstrated need for individuals making under $100,000, most veterans are under that threshold. So, me personally, I don’t think we should then be requiring the veteran to use their GI Bill when you are saying that you will meet full demonstrated financial need. And the institutions that are deciding to give the veteran the option are seeing a huge increase in their enrollment in the veteran community because these students also have plans for graduate school. So, through these conversations with our students and our partners, we’re able to have these incredibly meaningful conversations and dialogues. So then, admissions and now student affairs professionals can better understand what that funnel to admissions and through looks like. Another great example for you, Beth, is around housing. So, for a lot of our students who either have children or spouses, or frankly just don’t want to live in a residence hall, you know, working with that student population to understand what their housing options are, especially once campus closes over the summer or for Thanksgiving break. For a lot of these students, they are moving to your campuses and that is now their home.

0:20:59.0 Sydney Mathes: So, if your campus is closing over break, where do these students go, right? So, it’s again identifying some of those gaps and those barriers that inhibit a student from applying and enrolling, but also from persisting. And I know we’ve talked a lot about childcare. Access to reliable childcare for our adult learners is definitely a concern and something we are seeing and working with some of our partners to offer childcare to undergraduate student veterans. If you offer it for graduate students, same thing with housing. You have graduate housing, extending that opportunity to your undergraduate student veterans because oftentimes that population—age, lived experiences, coming with families—often overlaps.

0:21:47.6 Beth Donaldson: You’re exactly right. I love your overview of just the wraparound services, right, that we really need to provide to military students. What we found as we’ve been able to really survey adult learners and graduate students since 2004 at EAB, is that increasingly over the last few years, in our Adult Learner Mindset survey, respondents have said that they are looking for student support. And that is not something historically institutions have thought about. They’ve thought about supporting traditional-age students, right, in terms of mental health and career support, but that is something that military personnel and students are thinking about. They want to know about housing. They need that childcare if that’s available. I love the fact that you guys have developed the VetLink and really pushing institutions as well to think about financial aid and the services, such as keeping the residence halls open all through the year and keeping the cafeteria open as well. Because adult learners really, really need that. And they’re expecting that as they’re making their decision on which institution is the right fit for them and their families, right?

0:22:59.9 Beth Donaldson: So how are you able to get institutions to understand that and meet those needs? Like how often are you having those conversations with them or providing kind of that information?

0:23:21.5 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, I mean, like I said, we meet with our partners quarterly. But at the end of every admissions cycle, we go back and we look at our historical data. So, the number of veterans that we worked with who applied, the number of students who were admitted, and then also the number of students who ultimately decided to enroll, comparing them to market-basket institutions. And from talking with our students, “Why did you choose one school over another?” We now take that data back to our partners and we’re saying, “Hey, this is at our summer offsite.” We’re saying, “Here are the trends that we’re seeing amongst our student population.” “Here are the top three things they were looking for when they were researching colleges.” “Here are the top three things that made them decide to choose one college over another.” So we are relaying that information through those quarterly meetings, but also at the end of the admissions cycle when we meet one-on-one with our partners.

0:24:15.5 Sydney Mathes: And that has truly been one of the best parts of the partnership, is that it’s not just the partners admitting our students. I think that’s wonderful. More veterans need to be on college campuses, but it’s also helping higher education better understand how this population is making choices, making decisions on what their future education looks like. And that’s a narrative that I don’t think higher ed has focused on enough. Sitting down and asking, “What is important to you?” “What are some things that drove your decision to return to school?” right? Because that definitely isn’t the normal transition from active duty into higher education. There’s a very small percentage of individuals who do that. So, to be able to be, like I said before, you know, an ally and a voice for the student population in higher education is not something that I take lightly, but it’s something I’m just incredibly thrilled that our partners are open to and receptive to, truly investing in this population.

0:25:20.7 Beth Donaldson: Yeah, I love that. When we sat down earlier, you mentioned to me partnerships like the one that you have with 50 Strong to connect students with industry mentors. How do those collaborations like that expand the student support ecosystem for military learners, but also increase their career outcomes? I’d love to hear more about that.

0:25:45.3 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, so this is a new partnership for us, and it’s a part of the “Two and Through” pilot program. One thing we were hearing from students is that they would go to their career centers or they would go to their on-campus career fairs, and the recruiters didn’t really understand how to support them because they already had work experience, right? So a lot of the jobs they were coming with were entry level or didn’t necessarily mirror what the student was looking for. They have work experience, they’ve worked, many of them have worked for maybe six years prior to going back to school. So this partnership with 50 Strong was incredibly intentional. And I try to make sure that all of our partnerships, all of the work that we are doing is centered again around that student story and that student feedback. So hearing that from the students, I was like, what do you mean? You’re at some of these incredible academic institutions and you’re telling me that, you know, the recruiter’s like, “Oh, well, we just have entry level jobs.” So working with 50 Strong and the team there, they have an incredible network of employers that are truly dedicated to hiring and creating career pathways, not just entry level jobs for the military community.

0:26:57.6 Sydney Mathes: So when I was talking with the team there, telling them, “Hey, we had over 300 veterans at some of the nation’s top 20 institutions. How can we help them get into some of these funnels early so then we can start talking about internships and interview prep?” And, you know, what does it mean to have a civilian resume? Right? When my husband was transitioning off the active duty, he was like, “Okay, well, I’ve been in the Army for 12 years. So, what does a civilian resume look like?” So it’s being able to have those mentorship conversations early on in their academic journey to say, “Hey, I recognize you are a finance major and you want to go work on Wall Street. Let me plug you with some other individuals who have worked on Wall Street so you can start to hear, you know, what were some skills that their employer looked for? What were some things they highlighted on their resume? What were some connections? How can we network and get you in touch with more people?” And truly, I mean, I say this all the time, the military community, albeit small, is incredibly powerful.

0:28:00.0 Sydney Mathes: And now when you take that powerful community and you put them on a college campus where now they have access to research and other like-minded individuals and the opportunity to expand their veteran network, and then now we’re bringing them together amongst all 32 of our academic partners, I’m just like, “You all have an incredibly powerful network here. And how can we help our applicants leverage that network in a way that leads to meaningful careers?” Because I don’t want them to just get that first job after college. I want them to have a meaningful career that leads to long-term economic mobility.

0:28:38.1 Beth Donaldson: And you’re exactly right. Adult learners, their primary driver is the career outcome, to have a stable career that they love. So I love the way that you’re supporting them in that effort. So, Sydney, this has been a fantastic conversation and I can’t believe that we’re almost out of time. And I know that we’ve only scratched the surface of really this work, but, being respectful of time. Before I let you go, I wonder if you could really be able to share just the first two or three steps that you would recommend an institution who understands that serving military students is important work that should be done by their institution, but they’re a bit unsure of how they can deliver on that mission and strategic initiative.

0:29:28.0 Sydney Mathes: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, first things first, talk with your students. If you have current students on your campus, ask them to chat about their experience applying and their experience on campus. Some of my favorite conversations have been when I ask a student, “Hey, what didn’t work?” You know, everyone wants to say like, hey, what’s working for you? How are things going? But to ask, what didn’t work? What did we get wrong? Where did we miss the mark? That’s where you’re going to get the best feedback. So absolutely encourage, you know, anyone in higher education, admissions, student affairs, financial aid, right? Like, talk to your student veterans, ask them about their experience. And step two, I would say reach out to the team here at Service to School. We have conversations with partners, non-partners. We just hosted a roundtable around how to support student veterans during a government shutdown with colleagues who aren’t a Service to School partner. We will help a veteran apply to any school they are interested in, regardless if they’re a Service to School partner. But our team here is truly invested in improving higher education for student veterans.

0:30:31.7 Sydney Mathes: So if that is just, “Hey, can you take a look at our website and see, you know, maybe where we’re missing some spots?” or “Can you help us understand a little bit more about what a veteran or a service member might do in the military?” Like a lot of people don’t realize there are paralegals, there are medics, there are HR professionals who are enlisted service members. That is their job in the military. So please, please, please use Service to School as a resource so you can either better understand this population for admissions or better understand how you can support this population once they arrive on your campus.

0:31:06.5 Beth Donaldson: Well, Sydney, this has been great. As you know, there are a variety of ways that institutions can really find prospective veterans and active military. I’m thinking of really being able to expand their marketing strategy to include or targeting of military bases or developing pipelines with community colleges as we think about student platforms such as Apply at Advance and nonprofit organizations like Service to School, who are dedicated to supporting veterans in a different and kind way. So this has been an absolute pleasure for me to be able to sit down with you again and talk about the organization’s impact. So thank you for your time and don’t be surprised if I’m going to reach out to you in the future to come back and discuss this more. So I really appreciate you meeting with me again today.

0:31:57.3 Sydney Mathes: Absolutely, Beth. It has been a true joy. Thrilled to do this work, thrilled to, you know, be able to improve higher ed for our student population. Just love the opportunity to chat with you today. So, thanks for it.

0:32:09.0 Beth Donaldson: Awesome.